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May 06, 2008

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Obama's own voting record does not reveal any serious desire on his part to move beyond partisanship. What he means by moving beyond partisanship is that everyone else should sing his tune. And if Obama is elected, I hope Brendan will be as quick to catalog Democratic efforts to silence and vilify dissent as he has been to identify GOP examples.

there's something vaguely anti-democratic about his promises to end negative attacks and transcend partisanship

Huh?

Certainly you understand the difference between saying "your health care plan sucks" and "your wife is a terrorist". Obama has no problem arguing policy. It's the personal attacks that he wants taken out of politics.

And partisanship is a focus on the party rather than on ideology. There's a big difference between being a liberal and being a Democrat. The votes on the Iraq war and the Bankruptcy bill proved that point.

Adding to Jinchi's point, to say that Democrats are too liberal is not a personal attack. It's a disagreement with their policies, which is an appropriate part of a campaign.

Saying that democracy is built on polarization seems to over-state its role.

Different opinions can (and should) co-exist. What's needed is more of a focus on the issues themselves.

I also happen to disagree with David, to a degree. Yes, labeling certain policies as "too liberal" isn't necessarily a personal attack, but what does it really mean? If I use that characterizations to denounce someone (or their policies) doesn't that, generally, just contributing to polarization without moving the discussion forward?

We see these characterizations put forward as proxies for a discussion of the actual policies themselves.

Dissent, from any side, should be more than just a "no". There should be a "why" or a "because" associated with it.

I'm all for agon, and dissent, so maybe Brendan's post should worry me. But to think a President Obama would eliminate them somehow - or label them as 'unpatriotic' - is preposterous.

Obama is hardly anti-democratic (or utopic) when he talks about ending "negative politics". It doesn't rule out disagreement, only demonization. There's a clear difference and the latter has no essential connection w/ democracy. Politics is not (always) Hobbesian/Manichean; the other is not always the enemy. Those are lessons that this country desperately need to learn, if we're going to re-invest in infrastructure, change our disastrous energy policy, and fix a broken health care system.

You are right that a simple call for bipartisanship is meaningless. W has illustrated that pretty convincingly. But Obama is doing something more. He is more willing than other serious candidates to speak truth, to put sound policy before political points. The gas tax business is a good example. Obama is the first gentleman and scholar on this National stage since I don't know when.

Brendan, I don't think this is a fair charge. I'll admit, I'm not entirely sure what Obama means when he says "change politics." However, I take him to mean that he wants to end the kind of polarization that prevents serious dialoge. The kind of polarization in which dissenters become traitors/socialists/ facists, whose ideas are no longer worth considering and who probably don't even belong in this country. I don't see how this is un-democratic. At least, this is a common vision of democratic politics, embraced by Jefferson, Emeron and Dewey.

This may be a naive vision of politics, and it certainly should not be taken as a model for all times - I'm not sure we would have abolished slavery, if abolitionts had not been willing to use "polarizing rehtoric." Abolitionists like Thoreau, Douglass and Garrison all mainatned that dialogue with slave holders was pointless, as there was no merit to their position.

That being said, I'm not sure how the current political rehtoric helps us address our current problems. My understanding is that most Americans support Obama's health care plan, when both his name and the party label are removed. Perhaps Obama may be right about the kind of politics that is worth striving for at the moment.

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